I came across this quote, from Kira, the editor in chief of Epiguide. (Epiguide, for those unaware, is the hub of the websoap community, and has been since 1998, maybe earlier).
So there it is, guys. The webfiction/weblit world existed before y'all discovered it. I must say it irks me that people are so unaware of the history of the medium, especially on a site devoted to it. Maybe it's not lack of awareness; maybe it's the unfortunate sense that webfiction doesn't count if it's not commercial/fantasy or sci-fi/based on Drupal or WP/inspired by MU/fill-in-the-blank. The serials may not have been your cup of tea; they may not have been commercially successful enough; they may not still be around. Still, give up a little respect to those of us who participated in this realm long before b2/cafelog even existed, much less turned into Wordpress!
Ah, preach it, sister.
I've always sort of felt like this. My webfiction predates all the modern and "hip" fantasy fiction that you see today. I wrote the websoap's answer to Seinfeld (it was about nothing!) for eight freakin years (and published it for almost three: 2004-2006). I've never been into fantasy, sci-fi sort of stuff...just not my thing. I don't really like watching, reading or writing it. I prefer drama based fiction. Thrillers. Love stories. That sort of deal. The sort of stuff that you can find at Epiguide...from whence I hail.
I've noticed, since attempting to branch out into the "new" webfiction world of speculative fiction, zombies, warriors and the like, that while the authors themselves have been quite welcoming and accommodating to me (for the most part...), the genre itself seems largely closed off if you don't write something along those lines. I guess I shouldn't be so bummed out about it, because obviously, the fantasy stuff is where it's at...but it does seem like a bit of a slap in the face when I list my work on outlets such as WFG and the editors don't even bother to review it. Seriously. I didn't even get the two-line standard from Linda that so many bitch about. I didn't even get that, people! This is totally me bitching and I really should just let it go, but it felt like a slap to me. The message I got out of it was, "You're not like us, so we don't want you here."
I don't know. I'm just bitching and moaning, but it does seem to me that there's a real genre bias. It's like being invited to a party, but when you actually attempt to make conversation, everyone (hosts included) ignores you. I'd think it was better off to stay home in that case and yeah...in this case too.
I reviewed it :-P
ReplyDeleteOkay, I'm not an editor, but I did. (And Linda doesn't review all SpecFic either.)
Interestingly the homogenity of the WFG reviewers has come up recently on the WFG forums http://forums.webfictionguide.com/topic/helpfulness-of-ratings#post-5589 so it's not an unknown issue just a difficult to solve one.
Yes, you did, and that was very kind of you. I don't mean to discount those that have been welcoming to me and that did give me a chance, despite not being "one of the gang."
ReplyDeleteFiona's post hits it on the head to me. I'm sure it's not intentional, but the vibe I get from the whole shebang is, "this work isn't worth crap if it's not of this certain genre."
Thanks for sharing that with me.
OooOOOH! Fun to find myself quoted! Especially after such a long time. It's like planting a tree that hides in the ground for two years and then pops out bearing fruit.
ReplyDeleteI naturally sympathize with your frustration, Bex. There's no denying the heavy speculative fiction-leanings of the majority of the webfiction/weblit community. Fantasy is huge. Really really huge. You can't throw a rock without hitting a vampire/werewolf/wizard/shapeshifter/Elemental/demon/fairy (sorry, that should be "daemon" and "faerie" I suppose! :D). Same goes for larger-than-life spies and superheroes. It's true in film, comics, TV... The web is no different. People gobble this stuff up, and so it's only natural that avid readers become avid writers, and vice versa.
Still gets frustrating. One feels, perhaps irrationally, that it's impossible to get attention with a plain ol' earth-bound character drama.
But that's the way of things, and there's a real danger of unconsciously furthering the Balkanization of one's genre by giving up on promotion or participation.
I have to admit it feels karmic. You might not have been around for this, but over at the Eppy throughout the 2000s, we used to get sooooo slammed for being insular and soap-centric and generally unwelcoming to speculative fiction -- or anything other than "soaps." This despite my reaching out to specific writers, inviting them to join us, to participate in articles and blog posts, even to become moderators/forum guides. It wasn't that we had an intentional bias. The simple truth was that the Eppy was formed by websoap/drama writers, and the community that evolved focused on that genre. When I took over as editor-in-chief, I made a conscious effort to expand things.
Sci-fi/fantasy writers came, saw that they were a minority, and assumed that the reason for this was that we didn't *want* sci-fi/fantasy writers around. They stopped participating, stayed away. Without their participation, articles lacked contributions from the advocates of the genre ... and thus didn't attract new spec-fic types. Talk about a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Is the same thing happening, but in reverse, over at WFG? Quite possibly. ID is one of the very, very few non-speculative fiction entries. ASF isn't there; more notably, the consistent, longrunning fan favorite FP isn't either. I know why I'm not there (mostly inactivity and insecurity); why Michael, Ira (whose work would probably find a good audience there), Andy, Tom, and so on aren't there, I can't say. But people like us are missing, and so since the site is so top-heavy with spec-fic, it's the spec-fic writers (and hence, spec-fic readers) who gather there. It's only natural that they're more interested in their own genres.
I can't speak for Linda, 'cause I actually don't know who she is. :D If she's an official editor over at WFG, my guess is that she's just swamped. 500+ sites to review is no small onus! As far as non-official reviews... well, perhaps, as is the case with both APN and Eppy hosted forums, the truth is that many people prefer to give reviews of people whom they know, and perhaps in hopes of getting reviewed in kind? I don't know if you've done reviews yourself, but maybe if you do, that'll help encourage others.
Oy, another rambling post from me. I guess all this is to say that you're doing the right thing in taking part in sites like WFG and Muses-Success, and I hope you'll continue to do so. Even though they're slow to reciprocate or review, simply because their tastes don't run to mystery/character-based dramas like ID. Or ASF, for that matter. :)
Sorry about going on this long. All I'm saying is: I feel you, babe.
Hmm... none speculative fiction on the WFG...
ReplyDeleteWell the most obvious are Waiting for Spring and Servicing the Pole both of which have rave reviews and Cecilia Tan's Rose And Bay award winning Daron’s Guitar Chronicles but there are others. It can be hard to find them because people mis-categorize their tales.
Your best check is the modern fiction and Historical Fiction categories and even in those I see misfiles.
Kira, I was not around for that whole thing...well, the brunt of it, anyway. I remember reading about it, though. I also remember things like The Portal and others that we were not used to seeing, and how quickly they seemed to disappear.
ReplyDeleteI just moan and bitch a lot. I'm certain there's no real bias against me, nor is there any sign saying, "this girl is crap, so completely ignore her." Not to say it doesn't feel like that sometimes, but for the most part, I've made my peace with being the odd guy out. Again, it's not the authors at all. The majority that I have dealt with either via twitter or other means, are very nice and have never said a negative word to me. It's more the general vibe that "Demons and fairies are what real webfiction is all about. Everything else is just crap."
Am I bitching again? I am. Sorry.
You're right, though - Ira would totally have an audience over there. Perhaps the reason that Andy and Ira and Michael and Tom and Toni and others don't participate is they just don't know it's there. I know I didn't until I found it via twitter. Perhaps if they did, we'd see a bit of a balance shift...then again, maybe not.
I don't know. It would be nice if there were room for everything under one big umbrella, where everyone joined hands and sang Kumbaya. It will never happen, in web fiction or in life, but it's certainly nice to dream about.
Becka, I'm familiar with all of those you mentioned except Waiting for Spring.
I have to say, it really sucks that the attitude you describe exists. As a weblit author who writes and reads primarily SFF, I (of course) haven't run into it. I have often noticed that weblit is predominantly SFF and wondered why and if anything can be done. I guess if we authors are being welcoming enough, there's not much I can do, but it still sucks!
ReplyDeleteHey Clare,
ReplyDeleteIt's a bit disappointing at times, but as I've said, it's really no individuals that are perpetuating this...everyone's been very nice, even those that don't really "dig" my sort of genre. It's more the whole feeling in the air? Maybe I'm not describing this correctly. In fact, I'm probably not. But it just feels like there's something...different. Not necessarily offputting, but something that's really...different. I don't know. This could be all of my own misguided perceptions, but that's how it comes across to me.
Again, though, the authors are usually very nice. I've run across some rascals, but...that could be said for every genre and every single occupation, so yeah. It's just kind of feeling shut out. Like what you think or write or say doesn't hold the same weight or merit as someone else, because instead of a fairy or a demon that wears suspenders, you have...you know, a person. that wears suspenders. On sunday, at least.
I don't know. I think I'm rambling. But...yeah. You're fine, Clare. Most of the authors are fine, and there's little they can do to change the vibe that's out there. It's just out there and yeah...it sucks.